This is why the English press should shut up

[Workingman]

One of the things that is beginning to get my goat about Scottish independence is the divide and conquer tactics/rhetoric of some on both sides. We are cousins, brothers, sisters, fathers, mothers, aunts and uncles and lovers. The English are no different from the Scottish, as people.

Our shared problems are government and governance based in London. Many English hate that fact as much as the Scots do - ask the Cornish.

Yes, Scotland can be successful as an independent nation, as can England, but I would argue that we are stronger together than we are as individuals. What we all need, if that were to be the case, would be a lot more control for the regions and a lot less control from Westminster/London, maybe an English parliament - devolution of England from Westminster.

It won't happen though, Scotland will break away.

[cromwell]

Did you all know that the BBC has stopped ALL comments on their website on Scottish issues. Their experts can give out info but if it is wrong or slanted there is no chance of commenting/correcting.

Yes, that sounds about right!
Everybody can just shut up and listen to their "experts".

[Workingman]

The BBC website has a Scotland page. On that page is a long running special report Scotland's Future.

Why do I mention it and the BBC? One reason is that the BBC is by far the most accessed news outlet in the UK, for everyone. The second is that even though the report is specifically about Scotland, with a fair bit of Referendum coverage, a lot of it is written from a 'London bubble' perspective - I refuse to term it English.

Proof, if needed, of what Shaz is saying.

[Suff]

Yes, Scotland can be successful as an independent nation, as can England, but I would argue that we are stronger together than we are as individuals.

I have no issue with that WM. But it needs to be in mutual respect too. That, I fear, is sadly lacking from the English side. You only need to read any length of comments on the referendum on any English site to see that it is lacking.

[Workingman]

Yes, Scotland can be successful as an independent nation, as can England, but I would argue that we are stronger together than we are as individuals.

I have no issue with that WM. But it needs to be in mutual respect too. That, I fear, is sadly lacking from the English side. You only need to read any length of comments on the referendum on any English site to see that it is lacking.

Yes, Suff, but they are the loonatic fringe who feed off the misinformation and biased reporting emanating from the London bubble and the BBC. They are no more representative of "The English" than the rabid wing of the Nationalists, and it does exist, represent "The Scots" or even many hard line Scottish Nationalists.

From my point of view London politicians, London media, and the BBC, are playing the dangerous game of divide and rule and it for us - both sides of the border - not to fall for it.

I read quite a lot of the blogs and I do see, more and more, the level-headed ones among us challenging the misconceptions of the brain donors.

[Aggers]

There is no doubt that seeking Independence is a world wide trend now, and has been since WW2 and the break-up of the British Empire.

No country, it seems,is immune from it - the same forces are at work in other countries, for example in Spain and even in the USA.

One wonders whether this trend is the result of a world-wide dissatisfaction in the way politicians are carrying out their responsibilities now.
Personally I think that there has been a marked deterioration in the quality of our political leaders in recent years, and I put it down
to the universal curse of greed, the general lack of personal discipline, and obsession with playing about with modern technological gadgets
instead of doing the job they are being paid to do. Discipline is out of fashion now.

Personally I would jump of the chance of breaking away from a country whose leader supports Gay Marriage, and who, consequently,
I consider would be in a more suitable environment in a mental home.

[Workingman]

There is no doubt that seeking Independence is a world wide trend now, and has been since WW2 and the break-up of the British Empire.

No country, it seems,is immune from it - the same forces are at work in other countries, for example in Spain and even in the USA.

Absolutely, and the desire is expressed most strongly in those places where central government takes advantage of, or ignores, its regions

One wonders whether this trend is the result of a world-wide dissatisfaction in the way politicians are carrying out their responsibilities now.

In my opinion politicians have never been more useless and lacking in the essential life skills to govern.

[Suff]

In fact the Scottish devolution bill is a bit more twisted than most. It comes form deep dissatisfaction with the incumbent Lab Lib pact seen in Scotland since the assembly was granted by Blair. The referendum is a price of voting SNP and the vote for SNP was a deep vote of No Confidence for Labour and the Lib Dems. Not a vote for Independence.

Which is why I keep saying that the English can drive this issue by being dismissive and, well, English about it. The majority of the Scots did not vote for independence when they voted SNP, but they do understand that it is part and parcel of voting for them. The majority of Scots did not vote for the SNP for the independence vote (of that I'm sure) and are likely to vote NO at the referendum.

Unless.

The English stick their hooter in and start stirring the pot. Something, if you read a lot of Scottish history, has happened with monotonous regularity over the centuries.

If the English don't want the Scots to secede, the best thing they can do is shut up and leave the Scots to it. Most of them feel the same way.

As for Gay Marriage? Scotland led the way with the repeal of Section 28. That was a Lab/Lib coalition led fait accompli which the Scots generally didn't want. Voting SNP was part of the backlash to that one. So, yet again, Scotland leads England in the "progressive" arena. The fact that this "progressive" move is towards insanity is not a good thing but is something to be aware of.

Now if you think it through, the equivalent (sort of), of the SNP for England is the EDL. Of course SNP is very Labour biased which gives them a much stronger vote, which the EDL does not. However votes will go to the EDL as well as the UKIP instead of to the main parties. Just as they did with Scotland.

Another point to note is that this devolution bill is driven by a Scottish regional Government and not by Westminster. The Scots have Never voted the SNP into a power position in Westminster. As England does not have a regional Government it's unlikely that the EDL will do as well in Westminster as the SNP has done in Hollyrood.

Something to think about in the differences between the Scottish and English politics.

[Workingman]

Sorry Suff, but you have to stop equating "the English" with English politicians and the English media.

By all means attack them freely, but please leave "the English" out of it.

Most English I speak to are quite happy with Scottish independence, what they hate more than anything is the Flower of Scotland, Willie Wallace rants of some Scots.

[Suff]

Hmmm, I'm from Lincoln, worked a lot of my life in the south east or outside of the UK. I guess I see a very different "England" than you do.