HS2 cost skyrockets.

[cromwell]

Kaz, stop moaning! I have it on good authority that Gloucester's upgrade from Stevenson's Rocket is imminent!

[Workingman]

Kaz, stop moaning! I have it on good authority that Gloucester's upgrade from Stevenson's Rocket is imminent!

Yes, it's immediately after Crossrail 7 is finished.

Leeds - 34 mi - Manchester - 32 mi - Liverpool. Combined populations of the cities - 1.4 million, of the city regions 4.2 million, of their metropolitan areas 6.8 million. Rail infrastructure mostly pre war; road infrastructure mostly 1970s. Other cities / regions will be much the same.

Just about everywhere has been starved of real investment for decades, everywhere, that is, except for inside the M25.

[Kaz]

Kaz, stop moaning! I have it on good authority that Gloucester's upgrade from Stevenson's Rocket is imminent!

If I'd been one of the poor sods on the replacement coach service I saw leaving Glos station (probably for Swindon), this morning, I would happily have settled for Stevenson's Rocket!

[Kaz]

Just about everywhere has been starved of real investment for decades, everywhere, that is, except for inside the M25.

You never said a truer word! We really notice a difference when we go over to Staines to visit the boys

[cromwell]

Kaz, stop moaning! I have it on good authority that Gloucester's upgrade from Stevenson's Rocket is imminent!

If I'd been one of the poor sods on the replacement coach service I saw leaving Glos station (probably for Swindon), this morning, I would happily have settled for Stevenson's Rocket!

Blimey. Not good. In many parts of the country the passenger rail service actually seems to have gone backwards.

[AliasAggers]

The cost of HS2 certainly seems a hell of a lot of money.

However, when one sees on the television what some railways are like in other Continental countries, it does
seem that we have fallen way behind them, and that some improvements are certainly called for.

[TheOstrich]

Blimey. Not good. In many parts of the country the passenger rail service actually seems to have gone backwards.

Quite!

They have plans to re-open a grand cross-country route linking Cambridge - Milton Keynes - Oxford, a service which hasn't existed since Beeching.

In the meantime, part of this line, Bedford to Bletchley, has just received brand new rolling-stock to replace unreliable diesel multiple units. Yep, converted ex-London Underground stock dating from the 1980's!

Amazing what a paint job can do!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_R ... tchley.jpg

(Plenty more where those came from, Crommers, you might get lucky and get them to replace your Pacers )

[Workingman]

I seem to remember Pacers being sold to the public as a stop-gap effort until new rolling stock came in - that would be something like 35 years ago.

Then we broke up BR....

You see, this is what is so wrong. There is ancient rolling stock up and down the country that needs replacing, but not with even older 'upcyled' tube trains from Londinium. We need new modern trains, not a saving of 20 minutes or so between Leeds and Manchester to London.

[saundra]

... bolt a jet engine to it and stand back!

Just looked at the Liverpool to Hull route. It serves four of the UK top ten major cities, is 110 miles long and takes on average over 3 hrs end-to-end or 30 MPH!

That's when they arnt on strike for guards to remain on train's it's a terrible servicev

[Suff]

Blimey. Not good. In many parts of the country the passenger rail service actually seems to have gone backwards.

And you think it is only the UK? I can't get a late train from Paris down to Poitiers on any day but a Friday and the last train (23:50), is long gone. They may have a brand new LGV to Bordeaux, but my services from Poitiers have halved.

Also, as I recall, protests about the line have driven up the cost of implementation exponentially. Never mind the fact that the line needs so much tunnelling or that it goes through some of the most expensive real estate in the EU.

France paid around 7.6bn euro for the LGV from Tours to Bordeaux. Then again, the line was almost totally through rural agricultural land where they could work on it simultaneously along most of the line. Long lengths of it also run along the A10 Autoroute which means getting equipment to it was much simpler than if it was way out in the sticks. Allowing the track, gantries and cables to be brought in from hundreds of locations at the same time.

We are rapidly becoming the ONLY large economy in the EU without a high speed rail service. For those who have lived with it, they could not conceive of a reason why the UK would resist it so much. After all the LGV from Bordeaux is the equivalent of doing London to Edinburgh in 2.5 hours. Which, when you factor in boarding, debarking, etc, is just about the same speed as a flight.

I notice this entirely English approach to the whole HS2 discussion. We, England, need more other things, we don't need HS2.... Well if England doesn't do HS2, neither Scotland nor Wales will ever get any high speed connection. But that's alright then because the English will get what they need and the rest? They'll just get what they deserve. Isn't that it?

It is these kind of things which drive IndyRef…

I'm pretty willing to bet that the main noise about the cost of HS2 comes form those who tried their damndest to stop HS2, driving the cost up with their attempts.

Personally I don't want the UK to be a backwater banana republic. I want the UK to be a modern, connected, vibrant, county. Not one which lives on second rate solutions, congratulating itself on how well it implemented those second rate solutions.

Yes there are loads of areas where we need to fix stuff. But, for me, we start with a foundation in the 21st century. Not one steeped in the 19th century.

Well that's my view anyway.