Vocal Voices

I was reading the Guardian article on the Government using the Splitters to prove that the only viable option the EU has, for Brexit, is to engage with the government in place and get a deal done which will satisfy the Tories and the DUP.

I then read the following paragraph which goes a long way to explaining the EU mindset.

“We are waiting for Mrs May to come with some precise proposals because she said that she had some things to tell us”, Loiseau said. “Now time is pressing. We are about a month away from the UK’s exit, an exit which will take place on March 29 because she hasn’t given any signals that there will be a delay.”

So, let me see. May has been crystal clear on this.

1. The backstop can be in place but must not exceed 2 years
2. The Government is NOT asking for an extension and will NOT ask for an extension. The UK leaves 29th March

All I read from the statement above is that the EU still thinks they can get what they want and they believe that the UK will be forced to ask for more time so long as the EU continues to stonewall. They believe the UK has no other choice.

Meanwhile dominoes continue to fall in preparation for No Deal.

Visa Free travel. Open access for trade vehicles. Third country rules for Finance with no barrier to clearing trades (totalling some €1.6 Trillion per day), in Euro's. The right to operate flights into the EU.

What next? I can't even remember the loooong list of calamity and disaster which would descend on the UK for daring to leave the EU, but those four were at the top of the list.

Project Hysteria is moving towards reality and the hysteria is being proven for what it is. Just like the new oil fields and gas fields being opened I the North Sea because the companies can't sit on them any longer. Much to Scots absolute fury.

I feel personally that the conservative government has brought tbis all about through their own bickering and selfish attitude, I think most people in the country see the conservatives as the friends of big business because if conception is that they have so many fingers in all the pies they don't have one spare to scratch their heads to wake the brain cell to realise just what harm they are doing to the country and everyone in it, to me it smacks of the I'm alright Jack attitude we have seen over the last 50+ years.

Maybe I am wrong but when the referendum was taken along with it when Cameron did a runner was to form a cross party Brexit team and leave it up to them, not a succession of remainers pretending to work hard on the behalf of the electorate.

Manxie xx

manxie wrote:Maybe I am wrong but when the referendum was taken along with it when Cameron did a runner was to form a cross party Brexit team and leave it up to them, not a succession of remainers pretending to work hard on the behalf of the electorate.

With some 75% of the parliamentary MP's wanting to Remain, that scenario is even more guaranteed. In fact if you had done this, giving the MP's an out because it was cross party and, therefore, not the fault of any one party, it is almost certain that the end result would have been a "too difficult so don't do it" report, stating that the referendum was only advisory and not binding.

If anyone thinks that Labour would have done any better, or even half as well, they are deluding themselves. May is just a mere shadow of the total calamity Labour would have made of it. The entire front bench of Labour are solid Remain except for their leader and chancellor who realise that their socialist utopia couldn't happen within the EU as the EU would block it.

Cross party would have been the worst of all worlds. It is the eventual manifestation of PR. Everyone gets to blame everyone else because nobody is actually in control. Oh, wait a minute, that's the EU all over again!

If you look at what the EU is doing, right now, it is virtually certain that they believe we will crash out with no deal. The only way they can be truly certain about his is if they have already taken some decisions. One of those decisions, almost certainly, is that they will only approve an extension of A50 on terms which are virtually impossible to get through the commons.

You might have noted that the EU, having said they would "engage with the UK", reverted back to refusing to accept anything other than a total capitulation and an acceptance of their deal. They won't even add a legal text which limits the power they want to extend over the UK.

If that is not a wake up call then we might as well just go to sleep and wake up on March 30th and ask what happened.

This is a negotiation. One side is not negotiating. The other side is taking all the blame and being called a shambles. I hope to god that some academics, some time in the future, write this up and produce a book on how NOT to "negotiate" with the EU.

It isn't as if we don't have enough evidence. When the IMF walked out of the Irish negotiations on the bailout, the IMF said that the ECB were being intransigent to the point of insanity and the Irish were being financially suicidal. So much so that the IMF refused to engage in any further bailouts and the final Greece bailout had to be done with the ECB only.

Never mind the "negotiations" with the Greek government on terms, nor the "negotiations" with Italy over their budget.

But you actually have to read the details of the situation. 146 characters a go? Then May is stupid, the Tories don't give a crap and the EU are just misunderstood social reformers; just like Genghis Khan!

I agree with Manxie re big business. Big business is overwhelmingly pro EU membership.

In all the TV coverage of Brexit, in all the endless hours of it, 99.99% of that coverage has been about the great God of "the economy".
How many times have you heard the political aspects of the EU mentioned? Never, in my case. How many times has the European Court of Justice been mentioned? Not many.
How many times has the future political direction of the EU been speculated on? Never.

Cromwell, you can't actually talk about the EU as an entity. Because it is not you know. It's just a trading bloc. Sorry I can't reach the keyboard because my nose is pushing me away.

However what does it say to you that the "business" party is more behind Brexit than the "people's" party???

There's a thought for you.

It is. The problam being that so many politicians have done a 180 on what they said just months ago, that you wouldn't trust a word they say now.

These observations about big business are somewhat justified, but then again business is a big part of life as we all know it, whether we live in Europe (EU or not) or some island nation in the South Pacific. It is not that other topics have been banned it is more that they do not take on the national importance of business.

I wholeheartedly agree that these other things should have been covered in more depth, that would have been a lot healthier for debate, but TBH both sides have swamped the debate with the economy. It is a bit late now for any change.