Time to halt the A50 process?

[TheOstrich]

I feel we should all pull together to achieve the best result for everyone that can be got.
Now is not the time for pessimism or dithering or sitting on the fence the future of the whole country and everyone in it depends of good negotiations with the EU.
My opinion is that for the next two years the best solution would be a coalition working group of all the parties with the sole responsibility of getting good fair terms for all including EU citizens here and UK citizens in the EU I stress FAIR TERMS.
On the whole the country runs itself to a large degree civil servants see to that as happens between elections.
After the Brexit is decided and agreed then go for new elections where everyone will or should have a level playing field, in the meanwhile it would appear we will have to get along with what we have and hope that everything turns out ok.
Manxie xx

I agree 100%, Manxie. Now is the time for everyone to be pragmatic and work together. Nobody is going to finish up with an agreement they fully support, but then the country was virtually 50/50 about staying in the EU or leaving, so what can you expect?

Just for once, politicians to set aside party politics and act with the public interest at heart. Yes, we are in a mess as a country, but maybe that's actually the catalyst for coming together and moving forward.

Similar situation as we saw in Northern Ireland. Paisley and McGuinness put differences on one side and came together all those years ago, and got us all out of a downwards spiral. Not all of us liked it, but it happened and after a fashion, it worked. You could say they were men of vision. We need similar now.

[Workingman]

OK I'll answer the Brexit carp.

When May called the election it was for *srong and stable* government to give her a stronger hand in negotiations with the EU because *no deal was better than a bad deal*. Those were the constant refrains.

We are now in a position of a government with the poorest hand - the EU has all the Aces, Jokers and face cards. The government is not strong and stable; it is not even weak and wobbly, it is a lame duck hostage to the fortunes of anyone who wants to go against it. It cannot deliver *no deal* because of the schisms in the Tory party, logic therefore dictates that it can only deliver the *bad deal* - the one nobody wanted. That is, of course, if it is actually the same government doing the negotiations after the next election, which will come during the Brexit negotiations proper and again take our eye off the ball.

I am lost as to how people can argue for such a position when there is an opportunity for us to stand back, sort things out, then come again.

So...

Workingman wrote:
Basically that was: Can we (temporarily) halt Brexit in order for us to gain time to sort out our government?

No we can't.

Yes we can. Far more qualified legal minds than ours have looked at the Law with regards A50 and in their legal opinion A50 can be cancelled, however, some of them do say that a legal test case would need to decide. Lord Kerr the author of A50 concurs. The UK could be that test case at which point, once it started, A50 would be halted until the case is completed. How ironic that EU rules could give us time to retrench.

Workingman wrote:
The answer is yes we can.... as you describe. We can then, at another time of our choosing, trigger A50 again.

Again in my "No we can't"

Again, Yes we can. There is nothing in the rules to stop any country triggering A50 at any time, and it does not need a referendum in that country to do so, the say of its government is final. If we suspended Brexit in order for us to clean up our own back yard there is nothing at all that the EU could do to stop us sending A50 MkII. If A50 was halted, for whatever reason, it can be re-triggered again.

I cannot be bothered with the Gib thing as it is irrelevant to the points I am trying to make.

Unfortunately I get the impression that my OP title: *Time to halt the A50 process?* has been looked at and people have gone off on one about Brexit without giving the slightest consideration to any other part of the subject. Thankfully I see and hear serious political minds looking at and asking similar questions to the points I have obviously failed to get across.

[Kaz]

Frank I absolutely think that A50 should be halted for now. Brexit is far too important to be rushed through, and this government is very much a lame duck one. We need to get our house in order first, and then carefully negotiate a soft Brexit.

[cromwell]

Yes,it might be better to halt the Brexit process. At the moment we don't even have an official government, do we? The Conservative deal with the DUP isn't finalised as far as I know so if the Conservatives don't get that then we face going in to the Brexit talks next Monday with a government that has no majority in its own country.

Theresa May. She has lost her close advisors (and no wonder) and because of her style of leadership she has alienated not only her cabinet but most of the Parliamentary party, no matter what they say in public. She has said tonight that she will lead as long as her back benchers want her. OK then. Say the next round of council elections deliver a disastrous night for the Conservatives, what then? If she goes in a years time it will be right in the middle of the two year window for negotiations and we will be having a leadership campaign in the middle of the negotiations, which is crazy.

I think that the question of the party leadership should be settled before the negotiations, which must delay their start.

Only problem is, we've already gone back on one promise (or David Cameron did) by not already initiating Article 50. We have kept the EU waiting for almost a year already; they have other pressing matters to deal with like the migration crisis, Eurozone unemployment, the reforms that Macron wants and so on. They will be angry at further delays and you couldn't blame them.

[Kaz]

No, you really couldn't blame them for feeling exasperated! I know I do

[miasmum]

Its just a complete mucking fuddle

[Kaz]

[AliasAggers]

Its just a complete mucking fuddle

That's a good way of putting it.

[Suff]

Its just a complete mucking fuddle

That's a good way of putting it.

In terms of this thread, it's not a good way of putting it at all.

There is nothing muddled about it at all. We, the United Kingdom, have requested to leave the EU under the Treaty of European Union, article 50.

Have a read. There is no exiting this. Yes, we might ask for an extension, but we would have to beg the other member states to give us a reprieve.

Article 50, paragraph 3

3. The Treaties shall cease to apply to the State in question from the date of entry into force of the withdrawal agreement or, failing that, two years after the notification referred to in paragraph 2, unless the European Council, in agreement with the Member State concerned, unanimously decides to extend this period.

We have been told, quite bluntly, by the Commission and the European Council, that we are expected to expedite proceedings as quickly as we possibly can.

Far from "Any nation can trigger 50 at any time it wants", reality is that any nation can trigger A50 _once_ and then follow the journey. The treaties do not actually mandate for a change of heart. Any country which triggers A50 should have thought it through first.

Just because we're in a mess because the voters thought exit from the EU was a non issue cuts no ice with the EU, the commission or the European Council. That is our problem and we need to own it. The date is set and we will be in negotiations in less than a week whether we are ready or not.

This discussion is now nothing more than "I think" and "I want". What we think or want is now irrelevant. What his going to happen is now in the hands of the UK government negotiators and the EU negotiators.

There is nothing else to discuss. Conjecture, hopes, aspirations or fears have no validity.

[Kaz]

It's called "opinion" Suff, and we are entitled to it!