What is Braverman playing at?

[Workingman]

It looks as though open civil war has broken out in the Tory party.

Oh, and three hours in to the march and guess where all the trouble has come from, so far - the EDL, BNP, Britain First and other right-wing nutters. Braverman's thugs, an insignificant minority, causing trouble. Well there's a thing!

[Kaz]

No surprises there Frank

[Workingman]

And let's be clear, when Germany lost WWI and the Austro-Hungarian Empire broke up Czechoslovakia was born. It contained the former German territories of Bohemia, Monrovia and Silesia. With WWII the Germans wanted them back - hence the Sudetenland invasion.

The Israelis have now created a new 'Sudetenland' in the West Bank with their Jewish settlements. Is it not so surprising that the Palestinians want them to stop and want their lands back? Gaza is another matter and almost impossible to resolve. Gazans and Palestinians are not the same.

I support the Israelis, in general, but not all of what they do.

[Suff]

I would be 100% with you WM if I had not actually read up on the history of Palestine to educate myself.

Unlike the former German lands which gave the excuse for the "expansion" at the start of WW2, the Arab state of Palestine was only a region for 400 years under the Ottomans. Then they became a colony of the UK and during the decolonisation the UK sort of complied with both League of nations statues and a UN decision. But majorly screwed it up too because of innate anti semitism in the Labour Party of the day. Something which exists to this very day.

Israel has complied with those decisions but the Palestinians do not accept them.

Palestinians are the first to call on the UN to rein in Israel but also the first to refuse to accept their decision on the land.

It is a twisted tale which is never going to fix with any reasonable settlement which includes Israel.

This is exacerbated by the Palestinian population growth. Gaza was never going to be anything other than a morass when they live within fixed borders but quadrupled their population in 50 years. Today fully half the population are under adult age. This means their population is likely to double again in the next 15 years. Just where are they going to put nearly 5m people?

I don't support wanton killing of civilians but I do support the right to wage war to remove a threat. The fact that Hamas are throwing their own population into the mincer to try and escape the consequences of what they have done only supports the fact that a war to remove Hamas is needed and that it will, in the long run, benefit both people's.

However the refusal to accept UN decisions and rampant population growth means extremism on both sides will remain.

We have to remember that neither of the religions involved are "turn the other cheek".